Ep 34 – MI from an Evolutionary Perspective
Ep 34 – MI from an Evolutionary Perspective
Glenn Hinds Ep. 34 – MI from an Evolutionary Perspective
Dr Abilio (Bill) de Almeida Neto joined Glenn and Sebastian for this unique conversation about possible underlying evolutionary mechanisms of MI. Bill 
is a registered psychologist in Australia. He holds a Bachelor of Science (Psychology) with Honours from the University of New South Wales and a PhD in psychology from the University of Sydney in the area of behaviour modification for which he was awarded a university medal. Professionally, he has applied behaviour modification techniques to a wide range of areas, including alcohol and other drugs, smoking cessation, correctional rehabilitation, quality use of medicines, and work health and safety. His primary scientific interest is in mechanisms of behaviour change that account for psychotherapeutic effects. He has been guest speaker at a number of international conferences and has published extensively in scientific journals.
Motivational Interviewing from an evolutionary perspective
Bill explores whether some of the effects of Motivational Interviewing can be understood through an evolutionary lens. The conversation considers why direct attempts to make another person change can trigger resistance, and how social hierarchy, perceived threat and the practitioner’s position in the interaction may shape what happens next.
The episode also examines oppositional behaviour as potentially adaptive, the idea that “it takes two to resist”, and how MI may reduce interpersonal conditions that activate defensiveness. These themes connect with Discord in Motivational Interviewing, Partnership and the Fixing Reflex.
In this episode
0:00 – Opening/introduction
4:00 – Bill’s introduction: “A long MI journey”
9:50 – Seeking a theory of MI to understand underlying mechanisms
20:38 – Why does telling people to change typically not work?
30:30 – “Our brains don’t know it’s the 21st century”
33:25 – Social hierarchy in MI conversations: Counselors taking the “lower place”
46:45 – Oppositional behavior as adaptive
53:24 – “It takes two to resist”
1:00:20 – The Rogerian influence on MI through an evolutionary lens
1:11:20 – MI helps deactivate unconscious mechanisms that hinder behavior change
1:19:45 – Understanding impact on clinicians
1:22:59 – End of recording
Links and contact information:
- Twitter: @billneto4
- Citation for paper: de Almeida Neto, A. C. (2017). Understanding Motivational Interviewing: an Evolutionary Perspective. Evolutionary Psychological Science, DOI 10.1007/s40806-017-0096-6
Listen to Episode 34
Contact Talking to Change
Glenn: glenn@glennhinds.com
Sebastian: sebkaplan34@gmail.com
Email: podcast@glennhinds.com
BlueSky:
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